Send us your questions for the Mailbag and Spend My Money at: Podcast@Autoblog.com.
"> the Autoblog Podcast, Editor-in-Chief Greg Migliore is joined by Senior Editor, Electric, John Beltz Snyder. They start the show by talking about the new cars they'd buy for $24,000 if it were 1995. In the news, Tesla delivered the first production Cybertrucks, the Jeep Renegade has been discontinued for 2024, we've received specs and pricing for the Fiat 500e, the Chevy Bolt's return is confirmed for 2025 and Honda's gona show some future EVs at CES. For reviews, our hosts have been driving the Toyota bZ4X, Kia EV9 and Audi SQ5 Sportback.Send us your questions for the Mailbag and Spend My Money at: Podcast@Autoblog.com.
"> the Autoblog Podcast, Editor-in-Chief Greg Migliore is joined by Senior Editor, Electric, John Beltz Snyder. They start the show by talking about the new cars they'd buy for $24,000 if it were 1995. In the news, Tesla delivered the first production Cybertrucks, the Jeep Renegade has been discontinued for 2024, we've received specs and pricing for the Fiat 500e, the Chevy Bolt's return is confirmed for 2025 and Honda's gona show some future EVs at CES. For reviews, our hosts have been driving the Toyota bZ4X, Kia EV9 and Audi SQ5 Sportback.Send us your questions for the Mailbag and Spend My Money at: Podcast@Autoblog.com.
">In this episode of the Autoblog Podcast, Editor-in-Chief Greg Migliore is joined by Senior Editor, Electric, John Beltz Snyder. They start the show by talking about the new cars they'd buy for $24,000 if it were 1995. In the news, Tesla delivered the first production Cybertrucks, the Jeep Renegade has been discontinued for 2024, we've received specs and pricing for the Fiat 500e, the Chevy Bolt's return is confirmed for 2025 and Honda's gona show some future EVs at CES. For reviews, our hosts have been driving the Toyota bZ4X, Kia EV9 and Audi SQ5 Sportback.
Send us your questions for the Mailbag and Spend My Money at: Podcast@Autoblog.com.
Transcript[THEME MUSIC]
GREG MILGLIORE: Welcome back to the "Autoblog Podcast." I'm Greg Migliore. We have an awesome show for you. This is podcast 810, over 800 of these podcasts.
So we're going to lead off with what would you drive in 1995? It was a fun listicle we did earlier last month, end of last month. And check it out if you're from the '90s, if you remember the '90s. If you're, sort of, a certain age, I think a lot of these cars are going to resonate with you.
We'll dive into some news. Big news in the last week or so about the Tesla Cybertruck, the end of the line for the Jeep Renegade, and it's the beginning of the story for the Fiat 500e in America as well as some other EV news specifically out of Honda. We'll talk about what we've been driving, including the Toyota bZ4X. Man, that's a mouthful, the Kia EV9, and the Audi SQ5.
So with that, I will bring in what I believe is a fellow geriatric millennial that is Senior Editor for all things Electric and Green, John Snyder. What's up, dude?
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: How's it going? Yes, like, 1995 is just when I was getting ready to get my license. And so yeah, that 1995 post, sort of, rings true at geriatric millennial. True.
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah, I think we're technically classified, without giving away too much personal information, as millennials by the census or whoever does it. I saw a thing that it goes farther back than you'd think. It's like literally like '78 or '79 for a birth year. And then it goes all the way forward, farther than you would expect. It's a fairly big generation, if you will. But then culturally, it seems like people, sort of, in their late 30s to early 40s definitely are more like Gen X.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: I've seen the argument that if you have-- you know, if you're in this, sort of, between stage and you have an older sibling that's definitely Gen X, then you are considered Gen X as well. I don't really fully identify with either. I have the best of both worlds.
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah. You know what we are? We're, sort of, like the silent generation. That's that group after-- like before the baby boomers but after the greatest generation. We're that group of people that was born in the late 30s, early 40s. And most of the time people either think they're boomers or they're the greatest generation. They don't realize like, oh, you were born in like 1939 or something, you know.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Well, I know my way around a computer and an electric typewriter. I'll just say that.
GREG MILGLIORE: I learned to type on a typewriter. But I will say this, we've both worked for AOL and now Yahoo. So I think that really is a lot of different punch cards when it comes to this stuff.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: For sure.
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah, man. In 1995, I technically did not have my license, but I was, kind of, right on the precipice of it. And this list is pretty cool. I think the staff had a lot of fun pulling it together. So yeah, I mean, obviously, if you're listening to this on the podcast, you got to check it out. I think it'll resonate with a lot of you guys as well. What did you go with?
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: I went with the Toyota MR2.
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah, that's a good choice.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: It's the second gen of the MR2 here. And you know, I was looking at some of the other ones-- my first car was a '94 Blazer, and I believe they switched that to the more rounded body style for '95, which I don't know-- and that Blazer was a hand-me-down from my sister. So thanks, Liz.
And the Subaru SVX was outside of the price range. I did like Jeremy's Yukon pick because that is a lot like my S-10 Blazer that I had. Mine was a four-door. But yeah, I don't know, MR2 is one that I always-- whenever I see one, I just get-- I get pumped.
Just really neat, sort of, budget mid-engine car. And yeah, that price point, the $24,000, which is the inflation-adjusted equivalent of today's average new car price that is just enough to get the manual transmission with the fixed roof. So that's what I would get anyway.
I don't need the-- I don't need to be able to take the tops off. I don't like the sun. I'm not a convertible guy. So yeah, it was perfect. Yeah, but there's a lot of really fun choices from that year. But go ahead and talk about yours.
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah, I know. Just listeners, so you know, the whole premise here was to give back to the future. I guess not 1980s but like car buying advice of what we would have driven in the '90s using, again, the inflation-adjusted pricing.
And some of this is probably realistic, some of it isn't. I don't know if my current stage of life if I would have driven a '95 Impala SS. I'd like to think I would have, but that's what I picked. And it came in right in that price range. I was actually a little surprised.
You know, I think it's a then and now. I frankly wouldn't mind owning one of these now. You know, you get that big Corvette V8 engine. They really, I think, dressed up the cop car, taxi car Caprice, made it something, kind of, cool.
I loved what they did with the wheels, the paint colors, some of the police package options that made it more of like a muscle Sedan. I just-- this car really resonated with me. And the starting price was $22,910 according to this amazing document that you keep sharing about pricing whenever we do one of these lists. So that's what I would have done, and that was my pick.
This and a lot of cars are starting to go up in price. You know, it's really become like a fairly modern yet technically classic, vintage collectible. I mean, I would have--
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: It's such a Greg Migliore car too.
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah, I know, I know.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: You've got your type for sure.
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah, I like this car. I have a neighbor who's doing something with a Caprice, and he seems to be, kind of, making it into an Impala. Hey, that's cool. I have another neighbor, other end of the street, that has an MR2. I think it's yellow. And every now and then I'll see that coming out of the garage and I'm like, OK. You know, you should drive that more. Another guy actually at the end of the street has a 240, one of the old Nissans.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Oh, nice.
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah, I just saw the taillights peeking out the other day when I was walking the dog. So yeah, it's-- I don't know, a lot of good things out here. I won't read everything, but, you know, Zac Palmer went with the '95 Integra GS-R. That was a cool car.
Greg Raza did drive the '95 Nissan Maxima, which that to me actually, kind of, really that car I think, sort of, put the Maxima really on the map in the United States. You've got the MR2 in here.
Associate Editor, Byron Heard went with the '95 Volkswagen Passat GLX, the really awesome advertisement. And Jeremy's Yukon GT two-door, which I think that's one-- I don't know. That's another one that really, kind of, resonated with me. I remember riding around in like friend's parents Suburbans and Yukons.
And I think that's actually a part of the business right now that you could-- and maybe somebody like scout will do this is make a larger body on frame SUV but make it two doors. If you look at Jeeps and like the Broncos, they're smaller vehicles relatively speaking. They're not small, but you know, you get a two-door Jeep, it's still smaller than the attitude or the feeling of like what a two door Yukon would have been.
Even though I haven't looked at the dimensions, cars from the '90s are way smaller than cars now. But it's the idea of a large SUV with two doors.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Yeah, my Blazer, I had the four-door. But it was big enough for me to sleep in it comfortably.
GREG MILGLIORE: Wow.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: I camped in it constantly.
GREG MILGLIORE: '90s were fun for you.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Oh, man, yeah. Yeah, get my license-- you know. In this list there's a lot of good stuff on there. You can get a Cherokee.
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: You can get basically any Cherokee. The grand Cherokees are ruled out. Those start at about $25,000. Yeah, there was-- yeah, there's some really good stuff. The Oldsmobile Silhouette, I remember--
GREG MILGLIORE: Oh, man.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: I never wanted one. I always was just, sort of, fascinated with it.
GREG MILGLIORE: Well, there is a very John Snyder car, the Oldsmobile Silhouette.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Yeah, and maybe now today as a parent of two with a dog, that would be better than an MR2 for me.
GREG MILGLIORE: It was more interesting than like, what was the Chevy one was I think the Lumina, right? They randomly put the car and made it a van variant. And then there was a Pontiac one as well. Yeah, man, GM was really into the minivans for a minute.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: And then eagle was still around then. My sister's first car before the Blazer was an Eagle Talon. But those are all well under the price cut there.
GREG MILGLIORE: I actually had a '93 Lumina four-door. It was the Euro Sedan. It looks like by '95 it would have cost about $17,000-ish, so, you know, there's that. I mean, honestly, I was really struggling between the Chevy Impala and the Cherokee because I love those XJs.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Yeah.
GREG MILGLIORE: Those are two cars, three if I include the Grand Cherokee, that I would legitimately love to drive right now and just have in the garage. So I don't know. We'll see.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: I had an XJ a few years after this. It was awesome, a little bit less comfortable to sleep in than the Blazer, just slightly like shorter cargo area. But I've got a neighbor that has like six-- like five or six XJs in front of and behind their house at any given time and all different colors, four-door, two-door.
I've always wanted to-- I hope I run into them at the Village Green sometime so I can ask them about it because it's neat. They're like collecting them. I don't know what they're doing with them.
GREG MILGLIORE: That was your chance to-- that could be your chance to get into one of those, you know. I mean, it seems like when you look around, you can still get into an XJ if you're on the hunt for it, if you will. Because I feel like that's really going to be-- going to get expensive.
They're either going to be like in junkyards or they're going to be on like Hagerty or Cars and Bids. And there's not going to be a lot of in between.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Yeah, you're probably right, although I do see some like pretty well worn ones on the road in Michigan, some of them lifted. But those are people that are probably constantly fixing them up just to keep them running and using them as an off-road toy.
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah, looking just at the Pontiac lineup here, you could get a Grand Am two-door for about $13,000. And then the Grand Am GT was about $15,000. My brother had a '95-- you know, I think he had a Grand Prix. He had a two-door Grand Prix, which was $17,000, which, kind of, surprises me that the Pontiac Grand Prix was that much back then like relatively speaking.
Gosh, that car was such a piece. He had-- it always was in the shop. And at the point-- by the point he acquired it, it was six, seven years old, which was pretty old for a Pontiac back then, you know but yeah.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: You can just get into a Saab 900 for this price.
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: 1995, you know, '90s cars, I think they're finally like, sort of, getting their due a little bit because, I don't know, maybe it's just nostalgia, rose colored glasses.
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah, that's true.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: There was some-- there was some fun cars come to think about.
GREG MILGLIORE: That's true. All right, I was just-- I was just listening to The Wallflowers. That was another band around that time that was pretty popular at the Counting Crows. I mean, Green Day was a huge deal back then. Yeah, man. It was a different time.
So all right, well, check out the list. We hope you, as you're listening at home, you've had a good time going down memory lane with some of these cars. Get in the comments. Let us know what you think. What did you-- what did you drive in 1995? What's a car maybe from that time period that, kind of, hits with you?
It's podcast@autoblog.com. So send us a note too if you want to do it that way. That'd be cool. And also, hey, spend your monies. We can do that as well. So let's check out the Cybertruck news. That was the big reveal of-- reveal, I say that, sort of, with air quotes of last week.
There's a lot to unpack there. It was essentially like some customers finally got some deliveries. There was a big event. Elon Musk, sort of, emceed it, some theatrics. We got some pricing and other details. And, you know, we really started to get at least something substantive about the Cybertruck after like what, five years of white noise or no noise for that matter on this truck.
So you know, it was polarizing, let's put it that way.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: For sure.
GREG MILGLIORE: What were your initial impressions?
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: I thought the actual production units I saw when they had the cameras on them, they looked really good. They looked really clean, you know, a lot better than the late prototypes and their sketchy build quality that we'd been seeing on the roads for that. So that was good to see.
As production ramps up and changes and all sorts of things, you never know. The production quality could be all over the place, but I was definitely pleased with what I saw with that regard, at least with these initial units. Some interesting things that you can get a range extender, which is actually just another battery pack that, sort of, installs into the bed. It takes up some of the bed space but gives you a lot more range.
Yeah, there's three different trims basically that Musk announced that-- well, that Tesla announced. Musk didn't really talk about the details of the car much at the presentation. But they published on their site.
There's a rear wheel drive model that's not coming till 2025, and that will be the cheaper one starting at about $61,000. And that'll do 250 miles of range estimated. Tesla says 6.5 seconds 0 to 60 so pretty quick and can tow 7,500 pounds.
Next up is the all-wheel drive dual motor version, $79,990 that comes next year. 11,000 pounds towing, 4.1 seconds 0 to 60, 600 horsepower, Tesla says 350 miles of range. And then there's the Cyberbeast which is also coming next year.
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah, that's, kind of, cool.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Close to $100,000, $99,990 but 845 horsepower, 0 to 60 in 2.6 seconds, and 320 miles of range also towing 11,000 pounds. So those are really impressive specs for that one. I imagine a lot of the performance videos that Tesla was showing off, you know, drag racing a 911 while towing a 911, that sort of thing, they were probably using Cyberbeast for that sort of stuff.
But, you know, the rear wheel drive model, $60,000. 250 miles is decent, but yeah, that's not terrible pricing. I know it's a lot more than Tesla originally said, but there's no way Tesla is going to actually sell one around $40,000 to begin with. I don't know that anyone ever believed that.
And then with inflation over the past four years, the pricing seems not too crazy to me. That's just-- maybe that's just me, but I know it does put it out of budget for a lot of people who thought they were going to be able to get one for you $40,000, $50,000. So that's a bummer in that regard.
It's still really weird-looking car. Really weird looking truck.
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: I'm not wholly convinced about the utility of it, just the shape of it. And the rear window seems, just the angles of it in general just seem-- make it seem pretty impractical in a lot of ways. But if it lives up to these specs, I mean, some of the stuff is stupid, though, like bulletproof doors.
GREG MILGLIORE: What do you need that for, right?
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Yeah, it's so silly. Yeah, that's where stuff-- there's just the way the car was presented as this futuristic, post-apocalyptic thing is just I don't know. It is what it is. I'm interested to see how successful the Cybertruck actually is. And I know there were a lot of reservations, $100 refundable reservations for it.
GREG MILGLIORE: Did you put one down?
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: I did not, no.
GREG MILGLIORE: OK.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: No, I'm rarely an early adopter of anything. I want to wait till something's been in production for a year so they can work the kinks out before I-- before I get it. But I don't know, if I was looking for a pickup around $60,000, I don't know, I'd consider it. You have access to Tesla's charging infrastructure.
GREG MILGLIORE: It's a big deal.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Yeah, which is great. I mean, granted with the deals with the other automakers, you'll have that anyway soon. And I actually-- it looks weird, but I, kind of, like weird-looking, sort of, ugly cars. But I don't know, what did you think of it?
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah, so my opinions are, kind of, all over the place. And I've been really interested to just, kind of, listen to like just the public tenor surrounding the Cybertruck, which has changed so much. I think that's, sort of, you know, reflected the change of the tone around Tesla largely based on a lot of the ways Elon Musk has been acting basically.
Because I feel like when this thing first launched, there was skepticism. But there was also a fair amount of maybe cheerleading by some of our automotive colleagues. Now I feel like most of that is dissipated. I mean, honestly, at the end of the day, I probably shouldn't even care. You know, it's really like, what do I think?
And I mean, I was putting all that other stuff aside. Just looking at the vehicle itself, I was a little surprised that the build quality seemed a little surprised. It seemed, I think of the key words there, seemed better than it was. I guess common sense would say we didn't really expect it to be as bad as some of these viral videos and pictures we were seeing.
Did anybody really think they were going to make a final product that was as crappy as that vinyl thing that Franz Von Holzhausen took the cars and coffee in Southern California? I guess I didn't really think they'd roll something like that out. So that appeared to be better.
Pricing is about what I thought. The original numbers they talked about, I mean, I don't think that was even going to hold true even then, let alone five years later with inflation and a global pandemic and all the things that impacted car prices.
From an appearance standpoint, I, kind of, like what it is. I like interesting design. I think, you know, I don't have to buy it. It's like, as a car-- as a car enthusiast, I can, kind of, like a wedge shaped thing and then just move on with my life. If you like it that much, go buy it. If you don't, cool. Get into the comments. Either way, it's a free country. Do whatever you want.
And I think, you know, I tend to like it when car makers take risks in design. Otherwise, you just have like, I don't know, the mid-sized SUV segment where everything looks like an Explorer, you know. So why not take a risk?
Stainless steel, you know, I think they made this about as hard on themselves as they probably could have by doing that. They could have got this thing out without doing that. You look at DeLorean, I mean, what other significant examples in automotive history can you think of where they did this, right? It's pretty few and far between.
But clearly, they wanted to make this like a desirable object, not just a truck, not even just like a luxury item. They wanted it to be almost like a cultural touchstone. I don't think they necessarily have achieved that nor are they going to, because I think, frankly, you know, I think a lot of people at this point are, sort of, also turned off by Tesla.
It's flipped a little bit from where it was five years ago, where you know, Tesla was on the Vanguard of EVs. And they're still the largest EV maker in the United States, which is significant. But I think there's been blowback from, you know, a lot of different corners towards, you know, Elon Musk in particular.
Now, I don't know if that's enough to stop people from buying his products or not. I don't know because a lot of people still use Twitter even if they don't like him. It's a tool that they need in their life. So all that's to say that I feel like, you know, the honeymoon for a lot of his products where you would just roll them out and everybody would love them like a lot of people would is definitely over.
And there was a poll this morning or yesterday about how 2/3 of Americans wouldn't even buy a Cybertruck. I don't know. I don't know if I'd necessarily put myself in that camp because I think all cars are interesting and there's a lot of things at play. But it did seem to get a much more cynical reaction than I almost would have maybe expected back in '17 or '18 or whenever they first show this thing. So I'm a little all over the place.
I mean, wedge shaped design, stainless steel, sign me up. Electric, cool. Is it really a truck? Not really. It's like an El Camino or a crossover is what it really is because it's enclosed, which I don't know, frankly, that kind of works better for me. If I were to buy a pickup, I'd probably get a mid-sized truck with a tonneau cover on it. So that doesn't necessarily dissuade me.
Pricing, whatever, you throw the intangibles about Tesla and Musk, so I mean, man, there's a lot to unpack. There's a lot of baggage.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Yeah, I'm interested to see how the whole stainless steel thing shakes out. I mean, it's an interesting material. I mean, you're going to be less-- almost invulnerable to rust. But what does that mean for repairs if it gets-- if it does get shot up, you know, and you have to fix the dents in it?
It's going to be a little more difficult and expensive to repair, I think. And I don't know much about the cost of manufacturing, but I'll be interested to see how that affects Tesla's bottom line. You don't stamp it, right?
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: You, sort of, cut it and weld it together, which is interesting. I don't know if that's going to be more cost effective than the traditional production, but I'm curious to see-- you know, Musk said it's going to be a while before they start making money on these, which is not surprising. That's how Tesla does its business. It loses money on and that's how generally EVs work. You lose money until you start to make money.
But I'll be interested to see how that all shakes out and how if anyone else-- if it works out for Tesla, is anyone else going to follow suit? Will we see another stainless steel car?
GREG MILGLIORE: I doubt it.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: I doubt it.
GREG MILGLIORE: I'm reading this thing from Wisconsin Metal Tech. I don't know who the hell these guys are, but they have a kind of a random-- it's almost like a white paper, an article on just the very short history of stainless steel cars. It's like the DeLorean. It sounds like Ford did something in the '30s.
Let's see, Ford did something in 1960s with two Thunderbirds, which was actually a pretty cool Thunderbird, that generation of Thunderbird. Looks like there was a late '50s Cadillac, '70s Cadillac. And then, I don't know, it diverges into talking about cars with gold plating. So I assume stainless steel and gold plating, the use cases are about the same.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Well, if you could give the cars, sort of, a different finish but keep it that metallic finish, that'd be cool. Like a gold-- maybe not necessarily plate something in gold but give it a-- give the steel or metal a golden finish. That would be awesome.
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah, now at this point we're talking about flatware than we are like, you know, drivable machinery. So I mean, I think this is going to be one of the more interesting just stories of the car business in the next, say, like two years.
Are they going to be able to scale up-- is the public-- is there an appetite for this vehicle? My guess is probably yes. I mean, they have over a million, I think, hand-raisers. I'm not sure if everybody's put those deposits down or not, which is basically like four years of production like at the high end.
If they're churning out 250,000 a year, can they do that? Are these things going to be the biggest disaster since like the Edsel or the DeLorean or something? I mean, I just feel like when they build these in mass, we're going to be writing stories about just crashes, electrical problems, fires, dents, rusted out ones although the stainless steel, it doesn't rust.
But I just feel like we're going to be getting-- or maybe it'll go the other way. It's just going to be like, you know, like I said, there's a lot of baggage with Tesla, with Musk, with Twitter/X. But just looking at it purely from a product perspective, I can't remember another product that was this hyped, this anticipated and had this many variables.
Like the Ford F-150 Lightning doesn't have this many variables. We know the body is going to work. We're not worried about the body panels. We're not worried about Ford not being able to make them because they've been making trucks since World War I. Tesla hasn't.
They've done a lot of other things very successful. And there are things like, to your point, about the supercharger network that are really in its favor that other companies don't have. So it's just going to be quite a show, man. Sometimes-- what do they-- what's the saying, you root for radio, you root for TV, you just root for the internet here. We'll see. People seem to have no shortage of interest in it.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Well, I mean, pretty much anything that happens with it, it's going to be uncharted territory, so it'll be interesting to watch. There's going to be a lot of news on it regardless of whether it's good news or bad news just because it's all new. It's all just new things to deal with.
GREG MILGLIORE: All right, well, check out our coverage. This is another one. We have the story. You wrote it. It was also, I believe, picked up by our friends over at Yahoo, which is-- it's like we're affiliated with. Obviously, they own us. It's like we're affiliated with.
Jonathan Ramsey did a nice column, and James Reswick did a nice column too. So we, kind of, hit it a lot of different ways. So check that out if you know you need to-- just you missed it, check it out.
All right, so let's run through some other fairly quick news items at this point. The Jeep Renegade is done. It's the smallest Jeep. It was the least expensive, and it's going to be done after this model year.
It's interesting because, you know, I don't know, it was a nice entry point for the Jeep brand. I think it had some charm. I remember when they launched it. It definitely was a bit of a departure from everything else Jeep did. We liked it. We did a compact crossover test a few years ago, and I believe it finished second. It was behind the Kia, the Kia Soul, right?
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Yeah.
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah, we like that one too, but the segment's totally different, yeah. So I mean, it definitely had some supporters. You see them on the road.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: I mean, they used to sell a ton of them.
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: You know, when it launched, they were selling a lot of them and then yeah, sales have dwindled recently. They haven't done anything to the current model. So yeah, I don't know.
I want to see if Jeep comes up with a new entry vehicle or if they just leave it as the Compass. Because I mean, so many cars, I mean, so many entry level cars now are getting more and more expensive. The point of entry into almost any brand has gone up quite a bit.
So when you see something like the Buick Envista or the Chevy Trax and they end up actually being good, it's a breath of fresh air. So I wonder-- I don't think Jeep needs to have a cheap car in its lineup. It's, kind of, not where the brand is going. They just seem to be moving up-market with everything in general.
But yeah, I wonder if they're leaving some sales on the table by not having that more affordable offering. You know, they could have updated the Renegade and maybe seen sales climb again, I don't know.
GREG MILGLIORE: We tend to get a little nostalgic when almost any car is killed, like the Chevy Bolt and the Chevy Volt. And we'll talk about the Bolt here in a minute. But I don't know, it didn't sound like there was any real plan to really update this, and Jeep is going to get really like into hybrids, plug-in hybrids and EVs in the next few years. So I think they just had to kind of trim the fat somewhere, and it wasn't really paying the rent for them.
I think also, you know, I will give credit where credit's due. They did bring a character into this either compact or subcompact crossover segment when it was really lacking. That was one of the things we did really like about this at the crossover test, which we did up north. But it was also like it wasn't really competitive.
The powertrains were, kind of, meh, interior was dated, and even the charms weren't like all that charming anymore. It didn't really feel like a Jeep all that much, you know. It just barely felt like a Jeep. So when you got things like the Vista and the Chevy Trax, some of the things from Hyundai, Mazda, it's just like in this segment, you got to be good, and you still have to be fairly inexpensive.
And, you know, Jeep is making a lot of good stuff, but Jeeps aren't really cheap either. So long, I guess.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Yeah, I've really liked it, though. It was never a car I would have considered buying. But when we did that comparison test, I, sort of, fell in love with it. It's, sort of, badge engineered and whatever, but it definitely did have enough Jeep feeling in it for me to feel like, oh, this cheap Jeep is a Jeep. It's got all-wheel drive, four-wheel drive, and it actually sounded pretty good.
It had that, sort of, boxy shape to it that felt good to be in. You could see around you really well. Yeah, I try not to be nostalgic about a car that I never owned.
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah, all right, did you ever drive a Fiat 500e. I guess we'll transition to another small Stellantis product.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Right. No, not the electric one.
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah, so it's coming to the United States. We all thought we knew this. We all knew this. I think the, kind of, interesting thing here too is you could get a level 2 home charger, or public charger credits are included.
So you get this small, little electric Fiat, which some people I think are going to think this is a really cool little city car. You know, personally, I've never really loved the Fiat 500 for most of my uses because it's just too small. But it's definitely a cool design play. It's a European car, and I think honestly, it could be a really good city car. I think if they market it to the right sort of markets, this could work. So we'll see.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Yeah, it depends also on how it drives. You know, like the Mini SE is really fun to drive. It feels like a mini. If this thing feels sporty and nimble and all that, and it's got more range than the Mini SE--
GREG MILGLIORE: That's true.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: --it could be attractive to people who don't need to drive more than-- well, let's see. It says 149 miles of range. That's like a base leaf.
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Which there's a market for. Most people, at least in the US, want more range than that. But you know, the city dwellers who would prefer a smaller car that's easier to park and navigate narrow streets, 149 might be more than enough for them, especially if it's their second car.
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah, I think it could work if you live downtown any urban center-- Chicago, New York, Detroit, where streets are tight. You want something that's a little more nimble. I think this could work. You want to go electric.
A lot of times-- I mean, infrastructure is all over the place. It really is. So it might be for the person who drives short distances or like everyday short distances or who maybe drives like two to four times per week, I could see that. You don't have to charge it if you're just maybe trying to get across Chicago is a city that comes to mind because New York is all about, you know, taxis and mass transit. But I don't know. I don't know. We'll see.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Yeah, and if you're someone who rides your bike to work every day during the summer and just don't want to deal with that in the winter, it's not a bad choice.
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah, it's definitely a situation where it's a pretty-- still a pretty small market, if you will, but, you know, so it goes. I'm actually driving a Mazda 3 this week, which is bigger than a Fiat 500. And we'll talk about that on a future podcast.
But one of the things I'm really enjoying is just being able to, kind of, dart in and out of parking lots, traffic. It's like parking at my kids' school, it's like, you know, a dock of large SUVs. And it's like I can shoot in between parking spaces lanes and get out of there.
And it's like, go to any grocery store and, again, it's like, you know, ocean liners of SUVs. And it's, kind of, fun, plus it's a fun car to drive.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Yeah, when I had the Mini SE a few weeks ago, that was-- it's really able to work its way through traffic. You just almost feel like you're a ghost just slipping through everything and yeah, navigating parking lots.
It made running to the grocery store a lot quicker. I could just easily park it anywhere. Even if someone was hanging over the line, I could still fit in that little parking space and get in and out real quick and then yeah, super zippy. Fun having an electric powertrain and something that small. It just feels real peppy.
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah. Well, speaking of electrics, the Bolt is back. General Motors CEO, Mary Barra, sort of, confirmed some specifics earlier this week at an event in Detroit. It's 2025 is the timeline. It's going to be Ultium powered. We mostly knew this, but she, sort of, articulated it at an event. This was actually an Automotive Press Association event. So shout out to that of which I'm a member. I didn't make the event, but, you know, her comments made the rounds.
And I think I remember being at the event in Detroit at the Auto Show when she unveiled it actually. This was probably 10 years ago, the original Bolt. And it was funny, people were like, did she say Bolt or Volt? Because the Volt was still a thing then too.
Volt is gone, Bolt is back. And you know, I think it was a smart move by General Motors to bring it back. I think it was-- frankly, it was nice to almost reassuringly hear her lay out some details because companies say a car is coming back and then you're like, well, OK, when is it coming back? And this was pretty, pretty specific. So I think it fills a gap. It gives, you know, people who are looking to get into the EV space accessible price point to do so.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Definitely, the Bolt is very attractive for that reason.
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: And because it offers good range, and it was one of the longest range cars for a long time. So there's going to be changes and improvements to the new one to come out, but the current one is still super attractive to me.
I think it still has some life span in it even though they're killing it off. I'm really tempted to get one, and you and I have talked about this offline. I've, sort of, been bugging my wife, we should get a Bolt. We should just get a Bolt for our second car.
But she just doesn't like it. So she wants-- a Mach-E or something is more of her taste, which that's fine with me. I would not-- if she wants to-- if she's going to say, let's not get a Bolt, let's get a Mach-E, I'll be like, but it's more expensive. But I'm not going to complain all that much because yeah, that's a great car. I would rather have the Mach-E.
GREG MILGLIORE: Right. Yeah, I would-- that might be one you can lose the fight, if you will, and enjoy the Mach-E, I don't know.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: But for a car that is not going to get driven a lot, you know, not nearly as much as-- well, I don't know. Maybe if we had it, she would drive it more than the Palisade.
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah, that's a good point. That's a good point. All right, it's a good move by GM, and then we'll close out the news section here just, kind of, a preview CES. Honda is going to show its entire EV lineup. I assume there'll be some concepts mixed in here. It's part of their plans to go zero emissions, which I guess would be all electric by 2040, which is-- that's, sort of, the outer range of what we're seeing for companies.
Like GM has said 2035. Other companies have said even sooner, obviously, if they might have smaller lineups. But it's still-- it's a goal, let's put it that way, and they have it. And obviously, they're serious about it if they're going to do a preview here at CES.
Our Associate Editor, Byron Hurd will be on that trip to CES. And I think he's going to be covering Honda closely. So it's-- you know, I'm going to be intrigued by this. I think they have the prologue, which is Ultium based.
They created that with General Motors, and then I believe the deal ended. They both went their separate ways, which is just kind of interesting, considering they're both trying to scale up. But to me, this right now is the single biggest news looking ahead to CES in just over a month.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Yeah, I'm really excited to see what Honda has. In the teaser, if you look at Byron's article on it, the image that Honda, sort of, teased us with is this, sort of, wedge shaped car. You just see the nose of it and part of a wheel all clouded in shadows.
But it looks like something like it could be something pretty sporty, which, you know, that makes me excited. Honda's showing some really cool EV concepts in the past, like the Honda E and the Sports EV that they showed back at, was it Frankfurt or something? It was something-- I remember seeing it on the-- seeing them on the floor at Frankfurt, but they had already been revealed.
But hopefully, what they show us here at CES is going to be things that we'll actually see in the American market too. But whatever this is that they're showing the front end of is intriguing for sure.
GREG MILGLIORE: I hope they do show some sort of sports car or concept at CES. I think that's a good place to do it. There's a lot of vaporware at CES. And, you know, who knows how close that would be to production? But I hope they do it. Yeah, more on that to come. CES is going to be a big show this year.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Yeah, it is. And it's turning into more and more of a car show every year too.
GREG MILGLIORE: It really is. There was a little bit of ebb and flow there for a while, but what we're seeing is it's really stacking up to be a pretty big deal. Yeah, let's talk about our drive segment.
We got two EVs, and we've got a twin turbo V6. So you want to go first, talk about the bZ4X, which is a mouthful?
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Sure. I've been driving it the last few days, and, you know, I actually quite like it. I liked the Solterra a lot when I drove that. And that's basically the same car, but the Toyota feels a little bit more refined a little bit. I think it looks a little sharper, a little more mature than the playfulness of the Subaru.
But, you know, I've actually quite enjoyed driving it more than I thought I would. The interior is quite comfortable. The seats are excellent. It has these really supportive, well-bolstered, well shaped seats that yeah, I just really, really liked them. They just, sort of, fit me perfectly.
And I'm curious to see what other people think of it who have sat in it because it stood out to me immediately just how well shaped, and yeah, supportive, and comfortable they were.
It's very smooth-driving as you would expect, and there's some weird things about it like the steering column. When you adjust the steering wheel, it tends to block out the instrument panel, the digital instrument cluster depending on how you set. So that's something that bothered me too about the Solterra.
But I found that even with the steering wheel blocking half the instrument panel, it doesn't really bother me. I don't really-- after five minutes of driving, I don't really notice it. And maybe it's my brain just filling in the parts of the digits behind it or just shifting imperceptibly to see the rest of it.
And yeah, this one's all-wheel drive, so interestingly, it's got Subaru's X-mode. It's got an X-mode button in it for dirt, and sand, and snow. So yeah, there's definitely some of those Subaru things hidden throughout it.
And then it's got interesting materials. On the dash there's, sort of, a fabric, which is interesting. And it feels a little bit nicer than I recall the dash material of the Solterra feeling.
So yeah, the one problem with it is range. You can't get a lot of range in it. And when you get all-wheel drive, you start giving up some more range.
So let's see. You can get-- the front wheel drive version, you get 252 miles, which isn't bad. The all-wheel drive version that I have, it's the limited all-wheel drive, you get down to 222. And in the cold weather, that goes down quite a bit.
I haven't kept it at a full charge. I've just been charging it here and there at home, so it hasn't been all the way charged. But even that, I haven't even seen it close to 200 miles of range in this cold weather. But I do like that they offer a front wheel drive version of it.
A lot of EVs are either rear wheel drive or all-wheel drive. And there's no-- for me, the front wheel drive is a good in between. It's a really good way to save money on a car but also have it be usable in the winter, especially around here, like, I'm not too keen on driving rear wheel drive in the winter unless it's a lightweight car with really good snow tires on it. And even then, I'm probably going to try and avoid driving as much as possible in the snow.
But I'll drive front wheel drive in the snow all the time. And I might choose the front wheel drive all wheel drive of the bZ4X specifically because it's cheaper. It starts at $42,000.
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: And because you get more range. You get the full 252 miles of EPA rating, whether you actually get that much range throughout the year remains to be seen. But yeah, this time of year is always interesting to test the EVs because you just lose so much of that range to the weather.
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah, I remember that a little bit with that long term Kia EV6. It's just some of the range would disappear pretty quickly, and the charge times would be greatly lengthened. But I don't know, it's a cool looking car. I think it's definitely is.
Toyota, kind of, tweaks its lineup. You know, it definitely offers something on the showroom floor for, you know, Toyota buyers interested in an EV.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Yeah, definitely. I mean, you might get someone who's been driving a Venza for a while and sees this and like, oh, it, kind of, looks like that similar body style, a little bit sharper looking, almost looks like it has some Lexus styling to it and then all electric, you know.
But Toyota, who I'm already familiar with their electric motors and their hybrids have treated me well for years and years and years, I'm going to take the leap sticking with Toyota. Not a bad car at all.
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah, it's interesting. I think this could be the answer for EV buyers who treat-- I don't think with EVs being so different to so many people, I think it's still a leap and you would still be almost like-- early adopter isn't maybe exactly where we are but still be somebody who's willing to take a technological leap as opposed to somebody like me who's like, can I get an iPhone SE for cheap because my phone is broken? Or like the way other people buy microwaves or toasters.
But I do think this does offer that assurance to somebody like, well, it's Toyota. I've had a Toyota. It's electric. It looks, kind of, cool. It could be that right gateway.
So do I think it's going to be a huge game changer? I really don't. I don't think this is going to attract a lot of new buyers potentially to Toyota. But that does bring me to a car that I do think could be more of a game changer, which is the Kia EV9.
I drove it yesterday. I had the EV9 GT line with all-wheel drive as they say. It started at just under $74,000, so it was not cheap. It was actually a little more than I even expected. But for that kind of money, you're getting a three-row, electric SUV.
If you want to go rear wheel drive, you could get into it for about $55,000. So there's a fairly significant delta from the lowest to the highest price points depending on what you're looking to do here. Mine, total horsepower was 379 horsepower and 516 pounds feet of torque, so it will move. You can tow up to 5,000 people, and yes, you can seat six or seven.
And they're going to apparently build it in America in 2024, as I read the spec sheet here. I believe they're going to do that in, I want to say, West Point Georgia. I'm not sure if I have that totally right, but yeah, they're going to do that. So that would enable some tax credits.
It was an impressive vehicle. It really was. I know you're going to be driving it in about a month here out in California for a first drive too.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Yeah, I'm looking forward to driving it. I have spent some time with it in a stationary setting.
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Just packed full of features. The ones I saw were definitely higher trim, but just packed full of content as Kia and Hyundai tend to do. And yeah, really, sort of, catering to those rear passengers, trying to make them comfortable and give them-- there's lots of USB ports, and there was a drawer in the back of the center console for the second row passengers.
It had those second row seats with the leg rest and the recline much in the way that the front seats in some Hyundais and Kias do like the Hyundai Ioniq and Kia EV6 if you get that package. Yeah, really comfortable.
They use a ton of recycled materials throughout too, which is really interesting. But yeah, curious to see how it drives. Again, one of those vehicles where I wish there was a front wheel drive version rather than rear wheel drive just--
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah, as an enthusiast, you're supposed to want that rear wheel drive, come on.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: I know, but especially like in a three-wheel SUV-- I mean, three-row SUV, that, sort of, middle ground of practicality, save on price and range but still be able to drive it confidently in the winter. Front wheel drive would be nice.
But I don't know. I'm curious to drive it. I know the other Hyundais and Kias that I've driven, you know, they're either rear wheel drive or all wheel drive. The all-wheel drive ones do have that rear bias, though, which is really, really fun. And their rear motor setup is what makes that possible. So it does make the rear wheel drive versions very fun to drive as well.
So I can see myself enjoying that but just living with it in the winter. Everything's as the snow starts coming down--
GREG MILGLIORE: Winter's coming and you're thinking-- because I know you're very active in winter, and you want to be able to do all the things you want to do, so you need all-wheel drive and snow tires. Yeah, I mean, I agree. That's an interesting setup with, you know, rear wheel drive, but you know, I think snow tires, you'd probably be fine.
It really reminds me of like a Ford Flex, just that, kind of, barge, square box. It's a good size vehicle, you know, again, three rows. Car drivers said they hit 4.5 seconds in the 0 to 60 race. So I mean, I didn't really hammer it that hard, but I did give it-- you know, give it some throttle, if you will, on Woodward, in fact.
I drove it around yesterday morning. It was, kind of, a sunny snowy morning, so it can move for sure. Steering reminds me a lot of like some other electric cars, where it's maybe a little bit lighter at times. There's certainly that regen kind of vibe.
Yeah, I think it looks cool as hell, man. Just look at those headlights, the Fender flares, just the roof line.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: The wheels.
GREG MILGLIORE: The wheels look sweet. Kia does a great job with their wheels. Yeah, a lot to like about it. Honestly, it was a very quick loan. It's up for SUV of the year for the North American Car Truck and SUV of the Year Awards. So whenever those come through like a fleet, they're very quick loans a lot of the time.
And it definitely was a vehicle that left me wanting more. I'm sure you'll probably get a little more seat time with it, and I'll be definitely interested to hear what you think.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Yeah, I'm really curious to drive it as someone who drives a Hyundai Palisade, seeing what Hyundai and Kia have to offer in a three-row with electric. Maybe I'm shopping for my next car like five years down the line or something.
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah, I mean, it's definitely-- there's not that many electric SUVs out there, especially ones this big. So it definitely-- I mean, that alone to me fills a gap that things like the bZ4X don't really do. You know, it feels like there's a lot of compact crossovers that are electric right now.
There's a lot of them in different forms and shapes and price points. But, I mean, you know, we talked about why we thought the Bolt was so compelling on the small side in the more entry level price point. To me this is equally compelling on that other end of the spectrum.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Yeah, definitely. Yeah, looking forward to driving it, and yeah, I was peppering you with questions about it yesterday.
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah, I mean, like I said, I really enjoyed it. Oh, one thing I forgot to mention but I should, visibility was pretty good. You expect a three-row SUV to be like just a barge. But the a-pillars I thought were thinner than even some smaller cars I've driven recently.
It was better visibility for a variety of reasons than the Toyota Prius, you know, which has that very sharp roofline, the pillars are pretty thick, and you're low to the ground. With this, you're upright. It's a box. And the pillars, at least for the segment, seemed relatively thin. Get inside a Tahoe, man, and, you know, you can miss entire blocks of a street. So yeah, I definitely like that. It was very drivable.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Cool.
GREG MILGLIORE: Close things out with the Audi SQ5 Sportback, which was, I thought, a lot of fun. It's been a while since I've been in one. This one came in at $76,515, so you know about the cost of entry for a Audi crossover, if you will, in this segment.
Might hit, kind of, like a silver metallic paint with a magma red interior. The magma is an option which is included on this sort of package, if you will, this trim. I had the TFSI V6, works with the eight-speed tiptronic so very straight out of central casting Audi, if you will.
You know, it looked like one, it had the beautiful LED lights. It had-- there were LED lights inside. It seemed pretty quick, you know. There was that. It was like, sort of, like a torquey experience as you would expect the turbo to be.
I don't think it's a bad deal. You know it's like it's such a known quantity. The one thing I would say is you've probably driven a lot of Audi's with virtual cockpit. This one, I remember when that was like "Star Wars" just how forward-looking that seemed. I got in there, and I was, kind of, like, oh, yeah, this is just like 10 years on what virtual cockpit looks like. It wasn't all that special.
I didn't even like the infotainment system all that much. It was-- like the 10.1-inch screen I thought seemed small and a little dated. It was a little bit of a pain to toggle through different things. So you know, again, like true to form, again, straight out of Central Casting. But in some ways, it felt a little boring compared to some of the BMW, and Audi, and Mercedes vehicles I've driven lately.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Yeah, I mean--
GREG MILGLIORE: I don't hate it. Still like it but yeah.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: It is a little bit more, I don't know, buttoned up in those, I suppose. But in that way, it also feels more, I don't know, something mature about it.
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah, oh, for sure.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: It's a little bit of a conservative take on the segment compared to BMW and Mercedes maybe. But I thought it was really comfortable, really, sort of, versatile on different types of roads.
I had one a couple of years ago now for the first drive and during COVID. And I remember driving it, it just transitioned really nicely from like smooth, curving winding roads to dirt roads. It just took anything you could throw at it, any sort of road, potholes, you know, the highway, you know. It was just-- it just did well on everything. You couldn't really get it off its guard.
And yeah, so that says a lot about the suspension and the chassis in general. But yeah, I thought it was-- I liked the styling, especially the interior styling, very clean. Some just neat sort of architectural touches there.
Yeah, the virtual cockpit, it is funny how that's something that we've grown so used to now. But yeah, SQ5, I think the Q5 realm, my favorite is still the plug-in hybrid. Just really, really well balanced in terms of the Goldilocks of them. But yeah, SQ5 is pretty fun.
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah, it was very functional. We got like a wagon in the back, you know, umbrellas. I put a fair amount of miles on it, and I really enjoyed that too. I like driving Audis. I like-- people see the four rings on the hood and it's like, oh, that's an Audi. That's nice, you know. And it's definitely like the exterior design.
And the interior was pretty good. It had, you know, again, the red leather seats which were pretty comfortable, lots of that. I don't think it's specifically Alcantara but crushed, sort of, material that goes into the doors. There are some carbon inserts, so pretty attractive in a traditional sense there. A lot of stuff that five years ago would have been blown away by and now we're, kind of, like, OK, par for the course.
But, you know, again, drove very well. Audis, I like their general dynamics, especially. They make it do a good job of making a car in this segment a crossover of this segment fairly fun to drive. You know, 349 horsepower, I believe, so that's not nothing.
And I think I like the word you use that it's very like, I think you said it's mature, right? And that's I think compared to like say, a BMW X3, or an X3 M, or like an Alfa Romeo like a Stelvio, particularly in Quadrifoglio trim, or an AMG. Those are, again, also I think very mature vehicles, but they're a little more polarizing.
The Audi is just more like, hey, this is what we do. This is what we've been doing. You don't like it, you want that grill over there, you could go talk to BMW. But we're going to give you a silver crossover with a powerful engine, good chassis design, and that's what we're going to do. So I can respect that, you know.
Yeah, the other-- I think the, kind of, final point I thought was like for $78,000, you get a lot of different things for that. You know, like would I want to maybe go Wrangler or Bronco? I don't know, you know. Maybe something-- get like an entry level body on frame, you know, SUV or something. Like for $78,000, that's a fair amount of money. Is this how I would spend my money on it? I don't know. I really don't
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Yeah, probably not.
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: There's just so much out there at that price point. But, you know, for some people, for sure. They want something that looks good and, sort of, conservative but also sporty, yeah.
GREG MILGLIORE: All right. All right, it was a pretty lengthy show here. We are over an hour I don't think we've hit it quite as long as we went a couple of weeks ago with, I think we had about 115. So we'll try to get under that. Do you have any winter drinking recommendations for everybody who's still listening here?
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Let's see. When I go outside a lot in the cold, I'm always doing something-- checking on the chickens, playing with the kids, chopping up the giant branch that fell into my driveway to turn it into firewood.
And what I want after that, you'd think, you know, winter, you want like something dark and thick. But after one of those days recently, we went to Arbor Brewing Company and had their euchre pils. And man--
GREG MILGLIORE: Oh, that's good. I've had that.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: That just hit the spot.
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah, good beer.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Just a nice solid pilsner. That was really good. But also, you know, I did spend Saturday evening at Conor O'Neill's watching the Big Ten Championship drinking Guinness.
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah, there you go.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: That was also good. But that wasn't as active of a day.
GREG MILGLIORE: I had a pint of Guinness at Conor O'Neill's myself a few weeks back, and I had some of their Irish stew. It was pretty good. It's a good bar.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Yeah, I had the boxty, the pancakes.
GREG MILGLIORE: Oh, thought about that. Yeah, that was on the list. Yeah, OK. Well, I'll close things out with my recommendation. I think I've mentioned this before usually in summer, but I found a blood orange honey beer from the Cheboygan Brewing Company in my basement fridge.
I, kind of, was out of my normal just hey, here's a sixer of Labatt Blue or something just for whatever. So I was really doing some diving to see what might be back there because I felt like a beer. And I had like a 16-ounce pint of one.
This is available all year round, which I don't think I knew that. I thought it was more of a summer thing. Drank it on the patio. It was about 30 degrees, poured it into a pint glass. It was pretty cold, like I said, inside and out.
And I think that's a thing I like to do in winter is like maybe you shovel snow, you walk the dog. You've already been outside for an hour. You're wearing a parka. Have a beer outside and just, kind of, soak in, cool, clear night. And I really enjoyed that beer, really, kind of, reset the day.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: That's a pretty good one. Cheboygan Brewing Company is right down the road, sort of, from our cottage.
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: And so sometimes we'll go in there and get a growler filled. And usually, that's the one we go to. I've tried a lot of their beers. A lot of them are eh, but that one is yeah, pretty solid. It's, sort of, the one I go to from them.
GREG MILGLIORE: Yeah, I've got to-- I think I'm going to make a beer run tonight. Not sure which direction I'm going to go. It's just, sort of, like a hockey beer, you know, like a Labatt Blue, or maybe I'll get, let me try a sour or something, go a little different. We'll see. Take a risk. We'll see.
All right, that's all--
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: You can't go wrong with sour.
GREG MILGLIORE: You can't go wrong with the sour. I tend to think of that as more of a fall beer, fall or a spring beer transitional, but I don't know. That could be on the Beer Blog podcast coming up. We'll see.
JOHN BELTZ SNYDER: Sounds good.
GREG MILGLIORE: All right, podcast@autoblog.com, send us your Spend My Moneys. Five stars on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, wherever you get the show. Please get into the comments. Let us know what you think about cars from 1995, Cybertruck, anything else. Be safe out there, and we'll see you next week. Thanks for listening.
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